In Da Hood

hey,

i play college football on xbox, monopology, and risk with one neighbor; talk about the neighborhood raccoon with another; and wonder when the freaking house-to-rent across the street from us will finally be renovated.

does that count as knowing my neighbors? oh yeah, and i keep meaning to go down the street to play ping pong and pool with this guy who lives down the street and owns 3 of those little dogs that look like they have beards.

yes, we all need to meet our neighbors. a coworker says the reason we don't is fear. says that was somewhat the thesis of bowling for columbine. another said it's b/c of air conditioning (who wants to go outside when it feels so good inside?). there are many factors. mostly we're lazy.

but i think our generation is tired of it and is ready for change. so go meet one neighbor tonight! i actually know all mine, but it would be great to actually get to know them. you dig?

thanks for the inspiration.

The first time I met out neighbors she made a point of saying that they weren't being unfriendly, they just didn't want to talk to people and that they get so little time out in their yard that they don't always feel like talking to other people. I can definately understand, I know when I get home from work all I feel like doing lots of time is vegging in front of a movie with Gosey. Part of that is we don't really have a community here. We have about 4 or 5 couples that we are friends with and the closest one lives about 30 minutes away. How do you meet people though when your neighbors don't want to talk, your church is way too huge and you never see the same person twice, and your job is an hour from where you live? We both feel like our real community is two hours away in Chattanooga but that might be a co-out on our part.

JLG, I just don't think there's anything you can do about it, really. I mean, the entire current civic infrustructure is built against you having traditional community, or any community that doesn't involve you driving at least 30 minutes. And that's all of your neighbors too.

Its like, our cars became our tools for freedom, and then at some point we became inextricably bound to them. And civic planning compounds the problem, and its an insolvable one.

Think about it: today unless you're downtown, you simply cannot live without a car. Which is fine to an extent. But with every new housing development, it puts that many more cars on the roads, which means you need wider roads, and more parking lots, and thefore more commercial "big box" enterprises, which because of their size, the size of the roads, and the size of the parking lots pushing people even FURTHER away from their destinations, meaning that they need more cars, which means more road space, etc. etc. etc. Its a never ending problem, and it simply isn't a functional system.

Chattanooga is a very car dependent city, and becoming more so every day. I miss living in the Bay area where I could ride mass transit to just about anywhere. I talked to my neighbors a lot because we all rode the same bus together every day. I miss the distinctive neighborhoods - where I could go to the bread store every day if I wanted and walk to the market. There was no air-conditioned mall, fast food places, or billboards.

I know most of my neighbors in Brainerd because my street is mostly elderly and retired. They watch my home like a hawk while I'm gone to work every day. If I'm home sick they come knock on my door to see if I'm ok. But I wish Brainerd were a real community with a tree lined, sidewalk lined boulevard, with slower traffic, and fewer billboards, instead of the 4/6 lane speedway. I am particularly distressed by all of the cash/title/pawn shops that have opened on Brainerd Rd. It's becoming the next Rossville Blvd.

jlg: don't get sucked into this nonsense that says that surburbia and cars are the reasons we have lost a sense of community. The form of urban design has little to do with having community. I grew up in a quintessential surburban sprawl neighborhood and we have tremendous community. I have also lived in a "New Urbanist" neighborhood with zero community.

Dignan, nobody is saying cars and suburbia are the reasons why we have lost a sense of community, that's a far more complicated issue (and quite the esoteric one). What we're talking about is simple, practical things that can or cannot help with a type of city/neighborhood/community, and some of that may be related to "community".

I got the impression that that was exactly what Blue Sky was getting at. I think Dignan raises a good point in reminding us that "community" is not the environment but rather the people. Sure, there are things about some communities that help foster that sense more than others (e.g., sidewalks), but you can't make a rule based on that. I've lived in multiple types of communities, from urban to rural, and saw the same problems with not knowing your neighbor in each one. I think that if people want to get to know one another, then they can overcome their surroundings. It takes effort, which is what it sounds like you're putting forth on your street.

Scott I don't see why you can't make rules based on that. The rules are currently setup enforcing sprawl, and if you think you need some type of zoning policy (as opposed to none at all) why wouldn't pick the one that greases the wheels for community the best?

Josiah: you are correct in saying that the rules do help spur sprawl. But the rules do nothing in comparison to what most people want. It is quite obvious that a majority of people in this country prefer what you call suburban sprawl. I am no fan of the suburbs myself (I live in close to town in Atlanta) but my own aesthetic snobbery is not reason enough for law changes. The proper role of the government shouldn't be to promote sprawl, but it shouldn't be to discourage sprawl either. It should be to create the highest amount of freedom possible. There is a growing market for New Urbanist style developments but current zoning laws are quite an obstacle; instead of creating more zoning designations, we should create less.

Dignan, I'm not saying current Zoning policy encourages sprawl, I'm saying it only allows for sprawl. The structure of contemporary zoning laws are monolithic, and incredibly restricting of property rights. So I agree with you that we need less zoning policies, but I think you're incorrectly minimizing the extent to which people have little choice but to live in sprawl (for a number of reasons).

And while I appecriate and insiste on a person's responsibility for their choices, I also don't think that we can't point a finger at rules, regulations, cultural patterns, etc. that encourage and demand a certain type of living. And I'm also comfortable saying the many folks simply aren't aware of the systemic nature of many of their frustrations. I don't know too many people who enjoy sitting for two hours in traffic. They may like their suburban home, but its their suburban sprawl home that got them 2 hours in the traffic. People will make the connection, and are.

I'll tell you what REALLY kills communities: zombies.

Why do you love Chattanooga so much? My husband and I have lived here for two years now, attend Rock Creek Fellowship after an 18 month stint at New City, and moved here from Seattle--oh, and we actually lived in Moscow, ID, visited the Wilson church, read some of their books, and while I think he's got good theology, but a bit of an ass. Anyway, we love Rock Creek, but miss the West Coast and our church (Mars Hill Church) a LOT! Why should we stay?

Luce,

I don't mean to imply that I think all people ought to live in Chattanooga or St. Elmo or anywhere.

It's hard for me to codify why I dig Chattanooga so much. I came from Northern California, near Lake Tahoe, and when I first got here I found a great many things frustrating most of them centered around the pace of life and the fact things weren't, well, clean.

But the more I lived here the more I started to realize the South, in a sense, is like a giant dysfunctional family (or heck, just family). It has, unlike anywhere else I've experienced, a sense of community and belong-ing. Not that I didn't experience pockets of it in California, but it was a very transient one. As in, the community existed independent of a place. Everyone moves, and your friends rarely, if ever, live in your neighborhood or even in the same city.

But Chattanooga is different, its for more frequent that one knows their neighbors, works in the same town, and stays here for awhile. And even if they leave, they come back and they feel connected.

But Chattanooga is also different than "The South" in some respects, namely that its an incredibly dynamic and progressive town in many senses. I'll say it up front that it comes from, in alot of sense, the oligarchy that runs the city/county. Chattanooga/Lookout Mtn/Signal Mtn has some incredibly rich and old families, but instead of just sitting on their money, the pour it in by the hundreds of millions into developing the city and making it a great place for all Chattanoogans to live.

What I'm trying to say is that Chattanooga is a city, from the leadership nearly all the way down, that wants to better itself. It loves itself and wants to improve. 30 years ago Chattanooga was a dive, a total blemish on the mid-south. Now its a shining example to the whole country of what a city can do to make itself a vibrant and wonderful place to live and visit.

And that attitude trickles down into so much, the neighborhoods, the small businesses, etc. Maybe its the circles I run in, I dunno, but I can't tell you how many people I run into every day, rich or poor, the simply loves being here.

On the Fourth I went to a BBQ at my neighbors house. These weren't rich people in monetary means, but there were four generations of family present and rarely have I felt so quickly and warmly welcomed by people. It may seem trivial on one level, and it is, but here April and I are, non-Chattanoogans, white, edumacated, being warmly welcomed by a poor, african american family.

And when we had to leave to go to our Church BBQ, one guy named "Bear" asked me why I was leaving, 'cause "everything you need is right here, in your 'hood, why would you leave?" The sincerity of that statement just blew me away.

But I could talk forever about that and this issue. Mostly its really that I love Chattanooga and I know that others do too. But that doesn't mean I think that everyone else should love Chattanooga. Most of it for me is about the relationships I have here. The abundance of friendships now and the many more that can and will be formed in the future.

Once April and I went to a rodeo outside of town and they had the local Baptist pastor open the event with prayer. There wasn't a head that was covered with a hat or a head that wasn't bowed. It may seem silly, but reverence for, well, life like that is hard to find and I don't want to let it go just yet.

Ok, need to stop.

Josiah, have you ever read anything by Anderw Lytle? He talks about how the South is historically a more agrarian culture than the industrial North. There's this thing calls "the momentary man." That is, a person who has no roots, moves from community to community, and is relatively detached from his surroundings.

Anyway, he says that in the South people are more typically tied to the land...where they come from...where they live...etc. In the North (or rest of the country)...people tend to think more in terms of what you do (i.e., career).

For example, in the South when you meet people the first question they ask is, "Where are you from?" Guess what they would ask you up in my home state of PA?

Interesting stuff. Still, I wonder sometimes how much the community in the South is just based on "courtesy" and not genuine "love of neighbor?"

Anyway, I think that true community is found within the church...not in a locale. I think it is something that I did not notice until I became a man. That is, my awareness of a lot of things wasn't there when I was growing up. If I had gone home after graduating from Covenant, what things would I have seen differently? Perhaps if you spent enough time back in CA you'd see things there that you find in Chattanooga, too?

Oh, and BTW, when I was talking about "rules" before, I wasn't speaking of zoning ordainences, but moreso rules in the sense of "stereotyping."

Scott, I'm familiar with Lytle and in particular that thesis. Though I've never really bought the "agarian" idea as opposed to "small town", and even then, there are enormous farming communities in california and the great plains, but they don't quite have that thing.

A close relative of mine from the South once said that it had something to do with the incredible poverty the South has experienced since the Civil War, which has kept the culture largely immobile and forced them to expend their energies in people.

In PA you don't meet people (I lived in NEPA from the age of 2 to 16, in a town called Carbondale, a dead coal mining town). And if you look them in the eye, you get a dirty look in return. Where in PA are you from?

I too wonder about the courtesy thing, and I'm sure some of it being BS is a fair critique, but I don't think its all BS. You certainly can't deny the virtue of a guy in the neighborhood taking the time to mow, for free, without being asked, a half dozen of his other neighbors lawns. That's way beyond polite.

But I'm with you about the "church" thing too, but I dont' buy alot of what is meant by that when folks say it. I saw more Jesus at my neighbors BBQ than at my own church BBQ. So I suppose if you're using church little "c" as opposed to institutionalized church big "C" then I'm with you. Though we OUGHT to find it at big "C" too. O'Conner called it the "Christ haunted South", so maybe that's what we're seeing all over the place.

As to "rules" as "stereotyping", I'm not sure I understand your point then. Are you saying that the surban sprawl setup can become a "stereotype" which becomes associated with having no community (and then therefor a stereotype itself)? If that's your point I'd be ok with it if I didn't think it was largely the case that suburban sprawl works institutionally against "good" city setups (which help, practically speaking, with community) though doesn't necessitate a lack of community.

I think the Lytle thing also has something to do with the plantation past of the South. That is, land ownership is a big thing. Sometimes I wonder if that's not still somewhat true today, as I see more "estates" or "mini-estates" here than I did in PA. BTW, I grew up in central PA (in a suburb of Harrisburg).

With regard to the courtesy thing, someone once said told me that in the South people would stab you in the back, whereas in the North they'd stab you in the gut. The point being that some of the courtesy is fake.

Getting to your question about the church and community, I am increasingly convinced that the Kingdom of God is smaller than we imagine it to be. For example, when a person calls our church for assistance (be it with electric bills, rent, food, etc.), we ask them how and why they called us. A lot of times they say they just ran through the phone book (A - Z). Most of the churches that actually answer just plain don't help people anymore.

My point is that the local church (small "c" like St. Elmo Pres, CVPC, LMPC, Cornerstone, etc.) does not necessarily represent true community. The big "C" Church, that is, the church universal (i.e., the Kingdom), is where you'll find it for real. It never seems to exist completely in the local church, but I don't think it truly exists outside of the local church...if that makes sense.

One of the problems within the church, and a dangerous one at that, is that there is a lot of "plastic fruit" that we put forth. That's a term coined by Sanderson (the same guy whose name is on the building up a CC). Anyway, I recently read his book, Fruit of the Spirit, and it was honestly an eye opener for me. My life is full of fake fruit. Maybe some of the Jesus we see in the South is genuine, whereas some of it might really smell like you know what?

The whole thing about sterotyping was that I don't think the design of the community (sidewalks vs. none, snout houses vs. no garages, public transit vs. automobiles) can be blamed as the cause of a lack of community.

That would be like me saying that the elevators at work cause people not to be friendly and that we all need to take the stairs so that we can spend more time with people (which you can't fully appreciate until you've worked in a corporate setting in a large building).

Good post, good comments - Josiah, Scott, others. If we believe these things and are prompted to act, do we continue to act as individuals/families on these notions or do we coordinate our efforts? And yes, zombies in Stelmo would really kill it for me.