Evanescence?

Yup.

All my raving finally had an effect... :)

I think you're right, for the most part, Josiah. The thing I've liked most about Evanescence is simply that they sound really cool. Its fun music to listen to and I have a great respect for the things Amy Lee can do with her voice. I like to think that I've got a pretty diverse taste in music and most of the time I'll listen to just about anything. In fact, since I came over to Scotland I've really gotten into the classic rock (classic as in, older) genre. Stuff like Guns and Roses, The Who, The Eagles, etc etc. But I always end up coming back to Evanescence or Linkin Park because I really like the way they sound. Yeah yeah, I know its the teeny-weenie genre, but I still like it.

Let me point out though, I think you misunderstood what I meant about Evanescence loving to rock (I think I said that on my blog). I agree with you when you say its not real compelling when you hear it on an album or see it in a video. I was referring more to the concert Zach and I went to last month. I was pretty amazed at the difference between the recorded stuff and the live. I know there's usually a noticeable difference but this one kind of surprised me. It was a much edgier kind of sound. In fact, it reminded me ALOT of the Metallica concert I was at earlier this year. Instead of sounding 'washed over' or processed (like the album can often appear to be) the music was actually surprisingly heavy and it was great to see the band having so much fun up on stage. Seeing that really gave me a new respect for them. Not sure if this makes any sense...maybe I'm just allowing myself to be stereotyped even more.

As far as the Matrix thing, earlier this year I would have agreed with you. I think the same thing may end up happening to Linkin Park. But after seeing Evanescence live I think that they may actually be around for longer than you give them credit for.

You're forgetting one major fact about Evanescence, Metallica, and Linkin Park. All of them suck. A lot. Vocally driven, pseudo-existential, self-absorbed, poorly written shit-rock with really, really bad and repetitive instrumentation. The reason it's so catchy is that none of it's deep enough to seriously get your feet wet. You can jump right in.

My brother gets really annoyed with Evanescence because Amy Lee goes around claiming that they are the only band that mixes rock with operatic elements or something, which isn't true because there are bands that have been doing it for years, and who really rock.

Ryan, are you talking about all Metallica sucking, or just the Black Album and later Metallica? Because a lot of people claim that they sold out with the Black Album and just went downhill from there, with the ridiculous St. Anger taking the cake.

From the mouth of a moron:

Is it fair to judge a rock band using the word "existential"?

I don't really know if Linkin Park, Evanescence, and Metallica are self-absorbed, or even pseudo-existential (since i have no clue what that means), but I do like all of their music. When I listen to their music (or any music) I'm not looking for a deep philosophical, social, or political message. What I am looking for is a catchy beat, and lyrics that reflect something of a competent thought process (aka, none of these teenybopper bands that have catchy beats and the lyrics a 3yr old could have written). If I am looking for something deeper, I go read Josiah's blog, and stare at all the big words, wondering what they mean.

First, I think that whatever value Metallica may have once had has been more than destroyed by their later trash-fests, with the utterly terrible St. Anger sealing their fate. I've heard it. It sucks.

Second, I'm not always looking for a deep "philosophical, social, or political" message either. Actually, I'm generally pissed at bands that try for these things, since they almost always sound preachy and self-important.

But come on, the following is not an example of great poetry:

"i'm going under
drowning in you
i'm falling forever
i've got to break through

so go on and scream
scream at me i'm so far away
i won't be broken again
i've got to breathe i can't keep going under"
(Evanescence, "Going Under")

Nor is this:

"crawling in my skin
these wounds they will not heal
fear is how I fall
confusing what is real"
(Linkin' Park, "Crawling")

Nor, I assert, is this:

"Saint Anger 'round my neck
Saint Anger 'round my neck
He never gets respect
Saint Anger 'round my neck
(You flush it out, You flush it out)"
(Metallica, "St. Anger")

Catchy beat? Maybe. You'll have to make that call yourself. But competent thought process? Sorry, try again later. All I see is pissed-off white kids who can't even articulate their angst in an interesting way. In addition, they don't really have all that much to be angstful about, much less pissed off. They aren't singing about experiences they've had themselves, nor are they demonstrating anything like mature or thoughtful reflection on, well, pretty much anything. It's mass-marketed, mass-produced, and sounds close enough to rebellion - without actually coming close to being dangerous to anyone - to attract the white kids who buy shit like this.

There's alot I'd like to say here. I'd like to confront alot of what Ryan says. But in the end I know I can't articulate my thoughts as well as him or Mesh or Josiah and one of them would probably wind up running intellectual circles around me as I am reduced to telling Ryan to piss off with his elitist angry white kid taste in obscure indie garbage.

So there it is...come and get me.

See Rye-Dawg, this is why although I agree with you, the anger thing is well, not gonna convert Steele to the light side of the force.

I mean Steele all but admitted everything I asserted 'bout Evanescence, but that he really enjoyed their "sound." And heck, who can fault him for that? I still bust out the Justin Timberlake "Rock Your Body" and groove on occasion, aint nothing wrong with that?

But see, now all the work that was put into a thoughtful reflective discussion on the artistic merits of Evanescence is wasted. Steele's gonna put his foot down, draw a line in the sand, and refuse to budge. Heck, you'd do the same if I said "yo Ryan, your taste in music sucks." Doesn't matter if it does or not.

So Steele, please, remember that there is GOOD angst ridden white-kid indie rock out there (Though boy, do I hate most indie rock and musical-institutional masturbation).

I think the reason tha Ry-dawgg is persisting in his criticisms is that Steele has not yet made the ultimate concession. The difference between my enjoying Britney Spears and Steele enjoying Evanescence is that I am willing to admit that Spears is absolutely worthless trash on any moral, aesthetic, or intellectual terms, and that I love it for those very reasons, whereas Steele would still maintain that there is some value in Evanescence. I think Ry-dawg, like Don Quixote, is a man of principle in an age of cynics. T-minus is Rosinante, Shadow is Sancho . . . anyway, the thing is that it bothers him to see music he values for good reasons classed in the same category as music which no one could have any reason to enjoy but a perverse delight in modern mediocrity [the main reason I enjoy Baby . . . Hit Me One More Time]. Steele may have been trying to confess the utter vacuousness of Evanescence by reducing his defence to the simple statement that he enjoyed the sound, but the confession wasn't clear enough. The statement "I love Evanescence, throw human refuse at me," would probably be unambiguous enough to assuage the Ry-dawg's anger. This is just an analysis, I hope I haven't misinterpreted either of the combatants' positions.

Julian, you rock. Though I can't believe that you compared Britney Spears to any other musical entity which has a lead singer that actually SINGS. I realize that I'm never going to actually convince people that Evanescence is, in reality, not an utterly vacuous band. I figure, either you like them or you don't...its not something which involves conversion, its entirely a matter of opinion. In the same way that I can't stand much of what Rye-Dawg listens to, he refuses to listen to my own preference. Regardless, the reference to T-minus brings warmth to my heart.

At least we can all agree on Johnny Cash.

But only one of us has dropped $60 on the new Cash box set. The rest of you should stop by his "swank apartment overlooking St. Elmo" and get in on that Cash action. (Those of you still in Europe will have to be patient.)

Ryan, why the anger against Metallica? Very few bands have had more of an influence on modern rock, and, in particular, on the current state of metal. Metallica redefined the very way that rock bands played their guitars; they revolutionized distinct playing styles that are common place today.

Metal is about the sound, not the lyrics; to compare Metallica to anything in the folk genre, where lyrics and storytelling are the determining factors, is flat out ridiculous. Bob Dylan may have been a fantastic story teller and lyricist, but I guarantee you that he could not pick up a guitar and rip off the 13 straight minutes of riffs and solos that make up And Justice for All. And he certainly never played with a drummer regularly recognized and rewarded as one of the best drummers in rock. To say that Bob Dylan wasn't a good/influential musician because he couldn't play an electric guitar with the intensity and skill as Metallica is just as ridiculous as saying Metallica is not a good band because they can't match the story telling ability of a good folk singer.

And calling Metallica "pissed off white kids" who have nothing to be angstful about? Have you ever been addicted to drugs? Have you ever been addicted to alcohol? These are 40-year old men who have lived hard for the past 20+ years and have suffered through far more than you or I could ever imagine.

One final note about St. Anger: this album was recorded live, without added effects, and was meant to sound rough and just "not quite right." They were sick of hearing pop and the commericialization of metal, so they decided to produce an album that would reflect the way the felt instead of pandering to what the pop "metal" generation wanted.

Ben, if I were only half the writer you are.... Very well put. I agree with you completely.

Ryan, if you're going to be a music snob, at least make a distinction between early Metallica and their later sell out albums. Complain that the badness of St. Anger totally overshadows everything else that they've did if you want, just don't call them a bunch of angry white kids--they've been making records since you were a baby.

I just have to make this one point - that I cannot believe so many hypocrites could fit on one webpage!

To class Evanescence ''angry white kids'' is degrading and inslting to a group of talented youngsters. I'd like to see anyone here do what Amy Lee has done. And at 20 years old she has done brilliant. The sole purpose of music isn't to tell stories, but to be enjoyed. So what if Evanescence's or Metallica's or even Linkin' Park's lyrics don't make sense? They're making statements, not novels. Evanescence's sound is pure and simple rock, metal, whatever you wanna call it. So what if they appeal to gothic culture? you think any band asks to be? Do you honestly think Evanescence held a banner up in a parking lot asking moshers and goths to like their music? Hell no!!! They gave it their all and those who enjoy their music know what it is to enjoy listening to music, not criticize it like every other commercialized band in the world. They formed a band themselves and took it to the top on their own. If ''Westlife'' or any other manufactured bands could do the same on their own it would be them that would recieve the criticism. just because they are who they are.

So grow up and listen up - enjoy the music, because we're all forgetting why we listen - to experience a feeling that no other form of entertainment brings to our ears - just shut up and rock!

How many hypocrites can dance on a webpage: A question to ponder this Christmas.

just for the record evanescenscence Linkin park and metallica don't suck but what Devil inc should said shut-up and listen. by the way answer this why do they suck is it because they can sing or that they don't show their bodys or play gay. 50 cents sucks

Its because they don't show their bodys.