Why I Think Wilson Matters

So what I'm hoping to do in the next couple of paragraphs is to argue that Wilson & Co. including their ministry out of Moscow, Idaho really does matter beyond their localized community, and that it's a good thing to occasionally pay attention to what is said and produced out of that tiny corner of the Church.

And I say "tiny corner" on purpose. Because Doug Wilson and whatever group of people could be vaguely categorized as being in "his camp" are a very, very, very small portion of the Reformed world and an even smaller portion of the catholic Church. Most tried and true Presbyterians have yet to hear of Doug Wilson, and I think it's importance that we do keep the "very small fish in a very big pond" idea present in our thinking, because from one perspective or another, the traditions and community that give each of our identities the most meaning are always, to someone, tiny and/or irrelavent.

But I don't mean to completely compartmentalize the church into our various theological sects, and create a "cafeteria" attitude about the Church, where we all sit at our own tables in our respective social groups and ignore everyone else. In fact, I want to encourage that we attempt the opposite. I do believe that as Christians one of the things we should all agree on is that it's good for agree, and that its good for us to express real, practical, engaging unity among the Body of Christ. (nick, if you even try a comment on this post about why denominations are a great thing I'll just a delete it, so don't even try).

So from my tiny perspective and because in some manner or another I dig my presbyterian tradition with all it's highs and brutal lows, I want other groups in the Body of Christ to experience and dialogue with my tradition. Like right now, I know there's a big group of Chattabloggers who because of all these Covenant grads who blog on Chattablogs, are getting a real big taste of this Presbyterian thing, that whether or not we buy into all of it, when we blog what we talk about and how we talk about it will influence their perceptions of our tradition. I want Bill Colrus (sorry for mentioning you by name, but I needed an example), a local Chattanoogan and fellow believer who isn't a Presbyterian, to look over at my little tradition and community and say "Hey, they aint perfect, but they've occasionally got some good edifying things to say, and sometimes they really show Christ's love." That is of course, contingent upon us actually doing those things.

So Doug to me matters for a few reasons. He and his followers are growing in popularity, and to some extent with each passing year exercising a greater and greater influence on the Presbyterian world. Although I'm not sure this has happened yet, but sooner or later somebody out there when they think of a Presbyterian they'll think of somebody they met who attends Christ Church or is in someway affiliated with that community. So I kinda think it's my responsibility, because I don't want to solely exist in my isolated sect of the Body of Christ, that I pay attention and engage the trends in my tradition while also doing my best to pay attention to and engage the trends in other groups & traditions that aren't my own. Including Doug Wilson.

And all that is why I voice my concerns over Doug's occasional tone & style: because while I can look past it and read the many good things he has to say, those outside of our tradition and even those simply outside of his circle will be put off by his sarcasm & satire. It's because I think Doug has great things to say that I voice my concerns. It's because I think ecumenicity is a good thing that I wish Doug would tone it down, because the Church visible should do it's best to mimic the Church invisible, looking forward to being the Church that will one day be perfectly united in Heaven worshipping our Savior.

You're right on the money in recognizing that what is said by the Presbyterian contingent of the Chattabloggers affects how non-Reformed people view the R/P portion of the church. Though I'm currently attending a PCA, I'd never been to a R/P church before this year and I certainly didn't know much about the intricacies of R/P theology and practice. What I read on the internet -- on this and other blogs and on webzines such as RazorMouth, etc -- colors my view as much as what I experience at Rock Creek on Sundays.

It's a lesson that we should all apply to our own writing as well as our speaking and living. We represent not just ourselves, but our churches, our faith, and our Saviour.

Does Wilson matter? Probably. He certainly seems to be wielding increasing influence as time moves on. But he also seems to be entirely happy to preach to the choir. The only people who agree with him are the ones who already do. He isn't persuading anyone who disagrees with him of anything than the fact that he's more than willing to make fun of them.

Colrus described Wilson's demeanor well: "arrogant dismissal". And speaking as one who's pretty damn good at that kind of thing, I'm going to have to say that Wilson makes even me look like a shining example of humility. Which, as those who know me will testify, takes a fairly concerted effort.

The attitude that "the truth offends and if you're offended that's your problem" is a seriously dangerous attitude because of the assumptions it makes. 1) There isn't any way that anything the speaker is saying can be wrong, or even if not wrong, is in any way in need of tweaking. 2) Those whom the speaker is addressing need to hear what the speaker has to say even though they don't want to hear it. 3) Those whom the speaker is addressing need to hear whay the speaker has to say from the speaker and when the speaker wants to say it.

This, I contend, is not a humble insistance upon the truth. This is arrogance and condescension, regardless of whether or not the assumptions are correct. And I ought to know, because I'm good at it. Takes one to know one, and all that.

Is Wilson right about anything? Frankly, I can't be bothered to find out. I'm not interested in wading through his rhetoric. He certainly isn't saying anything original, and there are other people out there who are saying the same things and being a lot more agreeable about it. "You're not wrong, Walter..."

Does Wilson matter? I suppose. But he seems to be doing his best to make sure that he doesn't.

whether he's write or wrong is not a point i'm at any level of familiarity with to discuss.... but from what i read, this wilson dude sounds like an arrogant prick...

next subject please...

These above posts are some of the better ones I've read in awhile...and not just cuz mine name is mentioned...

A few more comments/observations...

When a person gets into a position of power in a church, like it or not, he is suceptible(sp?) to falling for/leaning towards worldly praise and love from his followers because many preachers are viewed on equal plain with any other worldly "personalities," and are often judged by things like their appearance, eloquence of speech, intelligence, etc. They write articles. People say, "That was great!" They hug someone in need. "That was a great thing you did." It feeds the ego, and the person wants to keep up that atmosphere so he will continue to give the people what they want. This is one of the biggest problems in the "church" today...Giving people what they want, and not what they need: True spiritual preaching, teaching, and Guidance from the Word. You can't say it better than God says it. You can't do it better than God does it. Wilson seems to me, to be protecting his world, and anyone who might dare to talk about it. Granted, I know none of his teaching, but if I sense rotten fruit going in, why am I going to bother finishing the bowl. Lord knows I am guilty of giving of rotten fruit. But at least I'll admit it. Wilson seems to think his "fruit don't stink," to borrow a bad pun.

Imagine what it would be like to fall at Christ's feet, looking for HIM to give you counsel, and teach you truth. That's the compassion preachers should have towards the lost and those who seek guidance - even their archest enemies. And that is the regard we should give to even the words contained in our Bibles - regarding the message like we are learning DIRECTLY from the Lord. If a preacher has different ideas that get in between what God intends to teach and what you are meant to learn, then that preacher needs to get out of the way.

What Mr.Wilson needs to recognize is that someone can lack his "wisdom," never have heard the word "Presbyterian," never have had a formal education, and STILL be saved.

Thank God for Jesus. If church was all we had, we'd be lost.

What Bill Colrus needs to realize is that Douglas Wilson knows all this. But would he take the time to find out? Apparently not.

Knowing and doing are two different things.

After several years of eagerly soaking up everything that came out of Moscow, this is the conclusion that I came to: I slowly grew to loathe the person that I became the more I immersed myself in his writings, and while he cannot personally be held responsible for my inappropriate actions in response to his writings, there comes a point when we must reject something by its fruit. I saw many of my frineds become such assholes, jsut like me, the more they read of his, and while this is certainly not Wilson's fault, it is wise an appropriate to judge the merits of someone's writing by their fruit, especially when the rhetoric is so strong that it is extremely difficult for those of us who are less educated/intelligent/skilled rhetoricians (that's most of us) to find flaws in the content difectly. I am, however, so keenly aware of my pride and sin that I think was enabled by his writings, that I not only am wary of is influence, I find it personally distasteful to injest. I also think this is quite a shame, because he is indeed quite witty and an incredibly entertaining and gifted teacher.

Nothing important to add to the discussion, except that you might want to know that the LucyZoe girl says over on her blog that people who criticize Wilson on their blogs "want everyone to hear their stories of how they came up against a mighty leader on their blogs and nicked his armor. They will mock the music of the church and laugh at the faithfulness and fervor of the people. Meanwhile, their own wives will be bitter and unlovely, their children will have forgotten Christ and followed other gods, and the curse of God will be upon them."

So take that Josiah, you're cursed by God for what you just said.

Ahh, but according to Doug Jones, knowing *is* doing.

I couldn't resist ...

So... the more important issue - are you for Oregon or Michigan?

Quack.

Sadly, I don't think any of my friends will be terribly impressed that I called Doug Wilson a name. By the way, what happens to us single, childless guys? Do we get a curse too? Or do we have to be satisfied by the bitter unloveliness of our platonic female friends?

Hey... Faith's doing snuff?

Once again. Go Ducks!

Ya, Friday morning Jeff and I were chilling workin', and like around 10 a.m. Faith shows up and she's got a Wendy's cup in hand. I figured, hmmm, I didn't know Wendy's served any worthwhile breakfast, then I realized she was all Bubba with her lower lip, and spittin' into the Wendy's cup.

Very gross. Jeff and I chastised her. John Perry was being a bad influence.